Isabella has been sitting quietly near the back, in roughly the same vicinity as Zohar. Her eyes are on Justin as she takes in this news. *Just when things were starting to get peaceful around here...* "How can we stop them?" she asks, surprised to hear her own voice speaking aloud. "/Can/ we stop them?"

Zohar's ears twitched to Timothy's question; a rather good one at that. "Usually they can control the fires, but when they don't they spread and have difficulty in subduing it. If that happens then we all have pretty much a choice to evacuate or roast in a miserably, smoke-choked, flesh-eating death..." He cleared his throat and straightened up a bit as he knew too much about fire....****Justin looked over the gathered assembly and took a deep breath. Nice job, Leon...bursting into the assembly hall to get everyone in an upstart instead of being a little more subtle. "In the old days we got by just fine with sabotaging equipment, which would put us at a risk of being detected. Or, we simply have to wait and keep an eye on their activities. Should things turn incredibly bad we might not have any other choice but to relocate again--in the end we can't stop humans from their decisions if they want them badly enough."

Brendan had just come into the room, and hadn't yet gotten an idea as to what the meeting is about. Climbing up onto a chair so he can see better, he cranes his neck, peering towards the front of the room and perking his ears to try and hear better. Something about 'fires' catches his attention, and he blinks, his interest now caught. Uh oh....never a good thing.

Tzolkin's ears droop, watching the proceedings continue. Already gears turn in the mouse's head of relocating, among other things. "How close are they?" he wonders aloud. -- Kivan watches Justin and Leon intently, for a few moments, and finally, he speaks up, "Vhat if we could convince them to leave by .. eh .. indirect communications?" he offers. -- Alex just continues to take notes, blinking a bit at Kivan's suggestion.

Teresa is sitting near the left side of the room. Her demeanor is of concern after hearing some of the rumors that were passing in the hallways as she walked in. Her ears were attentive after Timothy's question, curious herself of the answer. She herself was riddled with questions but was keeping them just as thoughts until she had a better insight as to what was going on.

Timothy blinks at Zohar. "Well... when you put it that way...," he says, feeling a bit sick to his stomach. He looks back to Justin and Kivan and frowns thoughtfully. "Can we, though?" he says quietly.

Leon ponders Justin's words for a few moments before shaking his head a few times and stepping closer to the Leader. "I don't think leaving Thorn Valley is really an option, Justin. When the humans showed up at the Rosebush, we'd been working on Thorn Valley for years. We don't have anything lined up now." He leans in towards Justin, lowering his voice a bit - though it's hard for him to whisper appropriately with the din of the Meeting Hall in the background. "We've got nowhere else to go. We need to..." He trails off, clearly in deep thought about the implications of his words. When he hears Isabella's and Tzolkin's words, he thinks a little bit, then shrugs hopelessly. "Maybe indirect communication would work, sure. Maybe the time has come for direct communication. And Justin," he turns to the Leader. "Maybe we could sabotage their equipment like we used to... but you're right, I don't think it'll deter them."

Darius silently listened to the meeting, trying to think of some sort of answer to the problem. Nothing just seemed to work, though. He frowned, leaning back in his seat a little. ~There's an answer to this. But what.....?~

Philip remains to the right side of Justin, keeping note of the responses of the few that he thought would show the biggest concern. So far his typical guess for reactions were coming true, but even he had no sure suggestion on how to resolve the issue. He continued to dart his eyes across the others, in attempt to read everyones expression.

Helios remains silent while thinking about these new preseedings. Though disturbed by this he doesn't really display the amount of shock most of the others have. Instead he begins to think about this logically. Waiting for a lull in the comoltion Helios says, "Basically we have a number of options. I'll start: First we can do nothing and hope the problem merely contains itself to the outlying edges of Thorn Valley. Second, as Justin mentioned there is Sabatoge or leaving the Valley but as Leon ilistrated leaving would be difficult. I don't think it would be impossible but it would be costly...." Helios pauses for enphasis on the word, indicating that the meaning refered to something a little more important than house and home, "in the way of lives. Our civilization could effectively evaporate." Helios takes in a breath before finishing. "Now those are the readily apparent options, none of wich are really that appealing. Question is, is there anything else we can do?"

Brendan's ears fold back slightly in concern as the conversation becomes clearer to him, and he can't help but voice his own opinion..."I dunno if it's already been brought up, but I think we can at least put together a group to go and take a look at the situation. Once we get a clearer picture of things, then it'd be easier to see where things stand, and we could make a decision..." he shrugs. "Plus...who knows? Maybe at the time we'll be given an opportunity to sabotage things if the right situation presents itself..." He then quiets down somewhat meekly as he gets a few looks. "Heh...sorry..." he mutters.

( Justin uncomfortably nodded to Leon's suggestions, but he wasn't too keen on the idea of direct contact with humans. The valley had been the Plan, and still it was the Plan. It wouldn't be right to go against what Nicodemus had in mind. "Indirect communication, Leon...remember why we're here...but sabotage is very a likely something we can try, but I don't think it would be successful in the end." He sighed and shook his head, taking in Helios' comments and Brendan's. **** Zohar slowly stood up after Leon's words, he one not to agree with the concept of direct communication. The one-eyed rat slowly stepped from behind Timothy. "With all respect, I do not believe direct communication with humanity is a very wise decision. I was not here when the Rosebush flourished, but one rat related to me was and he had a Plan, a Plan that is still in action today. We survive by staying hidden, living away from human kind's touch. If we made direct contact, you might even lure Dr. Schultz and NIMH back here. I don't about you, but I'm not too fond of being stuck with needles as I once was like some of you. Would you want to risk everything the Plan was about? We need a Plan II, a Plan that supports the predecessor Plan, that being that which has been planned and now needs a supporting Plan to further our current Plan." )

Isabella listens to the proceedings, and her eyes nearly cross at Zohar's remark. For now, however, she says nothing. Though she very much doubts that direct communication could be a good thing. She's never been subjected to needles, and doesn't think she'd like to be.

Mark stands just to the side of the door, it was always the case that in every formal meeting he was stuck with 'door duty' or that is what he called it when he was on guard shift for internal affairs. He tried not to make much of an expression at all as he would follow the colony's leaders orders, even if it lead to certain demise.

Timothy listens closely to the various issues presented... Sabotage wouldn't be long-term enough, he thinks. "And what if we get discovered if we try sabotaging them? What then? Ignoring them won't make them go away either..."

Leon raises his eyebrow, amused by Zohar's words. "So... you're saying we need another plan?" He smirks a bit then takes in a deep breath. "Before this news was delivered to me, and before I saw the humans for myself, I had no trouble believing that our original Plan - to live away from the humans forever - would suit us forever. Now, though, we have humans on our borders, burning the trees. If they continue further in, then our Plan will be undone by our own inaction. I don't want to wind up back in NIMH any more than anyone else here, but we cannot discount any options at this point." He stops for a moment, then sighs in frustration. "We have to do SOMETHING, and it's got to keep the humans from finding us. We must consider what the humans would do in reaction to our own actions as well. If we sabotage equipment, wouldn't they just bring new machines in? If we harm humans, wouldn't that just pique their curiosity and result in more humans coming in?"

Among those listening in is the mouse elder Vaspian, who's stayed fairly quiet amidst the conversation.. He looks towards Zohar while he shares his own piece on the matter.. He then clears his throat faintly, looking to the rest. "I do on a personal level find the idea of contact and coexistance with humans to be something that might some day be a possibility. However, on the same token, I also feel that neither they, nor ourselves are truly ready for such an endeavor.. From my experience among them, they are a curious lot, but at the same time have a certain... 'fear' towards that which is beyond their understanding.... In any event, perhaps it may be best to consider monitoring this group from afar and think carefully on the grounds of 'sabotage'. Any mistakes in their execution may draw even further curiousity to this place."

Tzolkin's ears perk a little as he hears something in particular from the front of the room. His whiskers twitch as he contemplates it for a long time, while Helios speaks, wrapping his tail around his foot. He starts to say something, then frowns at Zohar. "You speak in circles.." he remarks, dryly, "I may not have been around here long, but from what I have heard, despite your past situations with the human creatures, we have much in common with them. I don't think anything along the lines of sabotage will help us; no, that would essentially be starting a war with these humans. But we can't ignore them either, and honestly, I don't think we can hide forever." -- Kivan blinks as he hears a mouse speak from the back of the room, exactly what he was going to say. The old rat just nods as if agreeing, watching the other council members curiously.

( Quinlan finally stands up, clearing his throat and raising a paw. "Vaspian has a point. You forget, Leon, that there are places on this Earth where humans are afraid to venture. The deepest recesses of our planet, from caves to the darkest jungles to man-made disasters like Chernobyl. I believe that through some carefully planned actions against these... invaders... we can add Thorn Valley to the humans' list of hazardous places. )

Helios considers the various things spoken. "I agree that sabatoge over any length time would not be a good idea. It is true that it would eventually lead to one of us being captured and that would take control of our 'contact' with humans out of our hands. If it is contact that we are to make, and I'm not for this, or against it either...... it is important that we maintain control of this. And that's correct, last thing we need here is a visit from the NIMH team."

Brendan seems dead set on one thing..."I am NOT going back to that place. Not now, not EVER..." he shakes his head, shivering a bit. His thoughts briefly return to when he was in the cage in the pet shop not too long ago, and that was bad enough. "Whatever we decide to do, though, I want to help. I feel like I've done nothing but cause problems here ever since I got here...I wanna change that..."

( Justin reached for his gavel but did not yet hammer it down. Everyone had good points and bad points, but the idea of contacting humanity was something utterly unreasonable. His ears twitched this way and that, Elder Vaspian's points being well taken among others. "Zohar and Elder Vaspian both have strong reasoning behind their statements. Humanity is not ready, and I'm not too sure they ever would be ready to accept something that is not human nor rat--of course we were originally rats, but we're not anymore, and the same is for the mice. Right now we should have a constant watch on their activity while we decide further action. But, we must not initate contact." ***** Zohar looked over to Leon and gave him a plesant smirk back. "Yes, I am saying we a another Plan--it might not be the same as the original but it should be something to support it. As for staying out of contact with humanity potentially forever, I do have a solution for that. We simply pack up everything in an all-or-nothing motion to have ourself somehow shipped to a deserted island too small for humans to ever develop, far out at sea. That's one way of solving problems but I don't think many would be too keen on such an extreme idea." He looked back to Quinlan, and then to Elder Vaspian...something about that mouse he liked. Good voice in him, but then he looked back to Justin, wondering what else. "If we do something big enough that grabs attention it could also endanger us to discovery. If that happens, you know humans will want to find out what makes us tick." )

Jeff takes the moment to speak up. He remains seated, fully in uniform yet with his own personal scout touch he had one of his sisters modify. He was going to remain quiet and hidden in this topic as Xavier had already disclosed what was most important, but something made him change his mind. The tension in the room seemed to grow a uneasy settling in his stomach, more than the sight of humans starting random fires in the forest. "I think a valuable point is being forgotten here. Humans do not sit still for long. They are ever moving, and one day they could be burning where they are now, a few days later, here at our own colony. I recommend our best form of action is to discover what goals these humans have here. We sit in these halls trying to debate what we want to do, to form a plan. What if we can discover their plan?" His tone was one of suggestion as if reporting to his direct authority, yet his voice was youthful in spirit as if he was challenging the humans very presence.

Leon grins at Philip and points a claw at him. "Aha, see, THAT'S why you were the Captain! Justin," he turns to the leader. "What do you think about that?"

Helios nods to what Jeff says. "That sounds logical. Though, waiting around isn't something we can do for long. Understanding what their plans are is important." Helios pauses as he entertains another thought. "Now, it is true that what they are doing is burning off the old growth of the forest edge. It is a beneficial thing even though Humans generally tend to be messy about it. Also, it doesn't neccessarily mean that they plan to settle this forest. I know that within some of their communities there is an oppinion of preservation. Now before anyone comes unglued, no I am not saying that is what I think they're doing in this case. Just illustrating a point, and, the importance of finding out more."

Philip returns a small pleased grin at Leon but also perks a brow and looks to Justin with a questioning glance. He too was curious about the leaders response.

( Vaspian once again settles, listening quietly and refraining from stepping on anyone's toes, literally and figuratively. There's something to be valued in encouraging discussion and debate, as long as all things can be considered peacefully... He notices Brendan's reaction and gives a gentle smile, happening to be not too far from him and reaching over to gently pat his shoulder. "I can understand how you feel. But it may do you good to consider that there are even worse horrors in this world than Nimh... In that place, we were the product of a medical curiousity.. If we do expose ourselves to openly and without caution, there -is- the possibility of stirring even worse kinds of unwanted attention." The rest that he mentions of course is aimed towards the rest of the conversation. )

( Quinlan frowns a bit at Vaspian's comments. "I think we've reached a point where no matter WHAT we do, we'll need to actively consider how humans will consider us as a society - as a SPECIES. Mutual understanding is out of the question, of course, but they cannot be threatened by us. If they feel threatened, they'd sooner wipe us out than sign some treaty. I believe that fear, rather the fear of the unknown, will be enough to assuage the humans from entering here." He waves a paw at the others. "AFTER we know what their plans are, of course." )

( Kivan narrows his eyes a bit. In his mind Justin is being far too unreasonable, himself. "I would like to say zis.. yes, watching them is good idea. Studying them is also good idea. But we must not be caught doing so, and those doing the studying must blend with the feral population to reduce the risk of discovery." He pauses for a moment. "But should the human's plans become more .. threatening, I think zat an indirect contact, say in ze form of a note or other thing like zat, and unseen encounters can make them leave. Humans can be very superstitious; perhaps zis can be used to an advantage, for now. But contact is inevitable. It will happen. Ze question, is when, and vill we control ze circumstance." )

Timothy blinks at Brendan's outburst, biting his lip a little. He had forgotten his friend's experiences at NIMH... honestly; it wasn't something they talked about much. Still... "Are all humans so bad? What if... what if we could find some that are on our side?"

Helios says, "No matter what we do, there will be risks involved. The challenge here is to make the right decision that has the most acceptable risks."

Darius nodded slowly...Silently, he was taking notes on the various opinions and ideas mentioned so far and thinking them out...He had come up with one solution...But he didn't like it at all. It was something that he'd rather not do...

Mark hears footsteps making their way towards the door and with courtesy of the meeting going on he quietly presses the door open, allowing the coming footsteps to enter if they choose.

Brendan glances towards Vaspian as the 'elder' speaks to him, and he smiles a bit at the response. "Yes, sir, I do know that. I -have- been to the city a couple of times now, and have ran into trouble both times, so I do know what else is out there. NIMH is pretty high up on the list of bad things, but I understand that there are things way higher on that list..." he chuckles dryly. "No matter what's decided though, I wanna be a part of it. If a group is sent out, I wanna go with you..."

Isabella blinks at Tim's suggestion. She herself has only seen humans from a distance, and only briefly. From what she's seen, though..."But would that be enough?" she wonders aloud. "Even if they meant well, could they protect us?"

( Justin raised his gavel and hammered it three times to ease the increasing atmosphere. "All right, let's have order here!. Leon, that is what I was saying. We need scouts watching them while we decide further action. We can't sit here doing nothing while they are being watched. Elder Vaspian, wise words, and the rest of you also." He paused at Kivan's voice, listening to him though he found a little irksome he suggested the scouts blend with the ferals when know what their profession involves to begin with--avoidance of detection through any means. "Humans be superstitious and also be prone to eradicate superstition by investigation. Any contact that happens will not be in our control if the humans do not wish it to be." ***** Zohar looked between Justin and Kivan, and also Leon. It was too bad things couldn't be solved in a more...less chaotic. "It isn't a question on humans being bad, Timothy. It is how they respond to other intelligent creatures. If we make contact directly they will want to know everything about us. But, we're not here to discuss the possibility of when humans contact us, nor are we here to discuss why certain so-and-so as in position so-and-so. Some humans, though...are environmentalists, hence the forest being protected. However, I'm not so sure how they'd react to a colony of hyper-intelligent rats. We don't exactly have the best reputation outside their scientific communities." He slipped back behind Timothy and up next to Isabella, watching. )

Helios' attention is drawn by Timothy's comment as well. "You know, there probably are some among their population that would sympathize. But Isabella brings up a good point. Their 'government' is quite powerful. And if we where able to find a trustworthy human, an interesting endevor in itself, the same secrecy would still be needed. Though there would be advantages....
Raganzi enters the hall, cape wrapped around his body as he ignores any looks he may receive for his late appearance. Moving somewhat like a shadow he makes his way to his seat where the rest of the officials/higher-ups are seated, looking about he thinks to himself that it has been quite sometime since he's seen a gathering of such magnitude. He sits quietly and just listens for a bit.. he's been somewhat informed of the situation but isn't sure what decisions/measures have been taken for a solution. ((Still gonna take in a little more before really speaking heavily))

Timothy frowns as Justin bangs his gavel; this isn't just Justin's problem, after all... they're all in this same boat together so a solution should come from all of them. He looks over to Helios and Zohar, tilting his head slightly; he honestly doesn't know much about humans, but if they are intelligent creatures, surely they could be reasoned with...?

Leon nods to Justin and hums pensively under his breath. "Alright... so I'll definitely set something up with Xavier and his scouts. Perhaps I'll be joining them as well, just to make sure there's another set of eyes there. Until then, though," he says quickly, "I think we should hold off on coming up with any further plans."

Vaspian's head bows faintly to Isabella's proposed question. "Indeed... which is all the more reason to proceed carefully.... Honestly, it is their government, and perhaps even their military which gives me reason to be hesitant about making contact..." He again ponders... "I'm a little curious about the valley's tunneling system. You've managed to build this colony quite securely amidst this mountainside... If the humans -were- to come too close to this area, would it be possible, given enough time for us to work further within, or perhaps have a means of hiding away evidence of our presense without the need to move?"

Cynthia, having stayed the quiet mouse for awhile, eases an arm around one of Brendan's, and gently hugs it with both of hers while sitting nearby, embracing it in a comforting way, as she can imagine what this talk of humans and Nimh are doing to him.

Jeff mumbles something under his breath as he eyes Leon for a moment knowing something was up he decided to keep his opinion quiet again, contributing only facts as he needs to. Part of his mind regretting the urgency to inform the council as Xavier had.

Mark watches as another rat passes into the meeting. He waits only a few heartbeats of time before bringing the door to a latching close. He then stepped back to his position where he remained at post, standing at guard, leaving no option for him to get relaxed for what seemed to be the start of a very lengthy night.

Teresa shows a bit of concern as she watched her brothers reaction. She had no doubt in her eyes that his feelings were mixed on the situation considering his friend probably had told him all about NIMH.

( Quinlan considers the current ideas, but is quick to discount direct human contact. "The humans would never consider us as equals, only as curiosities. They destroy what they don't understand, and we simply cannot risk our entire species in such a way. However, if we show them that Thorn Valley is not a place conducive to human presence, we could be free here forever, regardless of what happens. Remember, governments change, but the collective mind does not. Fear can last for generations, and I think we can make the humans fear Thorn Valley without revealing our presence. )

Brendan appreciates Cynthia's efforts to comfort him; he smiles down at her, whiskers twitching. "Thanks, Cyn. I'll be okay. I wanna help with whatever is decided, I'm tired of being afraid all the time..." He gives her paw a pat with his own, leaving it resting atop hers, before he gives a light, reassuring squeeze. "I wanna show this place that I'm not just a troublemaker anymore..."

Philip takes the response from Quinlan as a chance to speak up, "Indeed Quinlan, you bring a valuable point to the table on this issue. However if we in turn react in fear, we too will fall to misguidance."

Helios frowns at Quinlan's comment. "Humans destroy what they fear that is true, but it sounds like you're contradicting yourself."

( Quinlan holds up a paw. "Humans don't destroy what they fear - they destroy what they feel is a threat. There is a fine line between a threat and a fear, and if we consider going such a route, we would need to skirt that line very closely. No contradiction - just an idea." He smiles a bit and sits down, tuning off to the outside world as he begins to write things down. )

Zohar cleared his throat and leaned to whisper to Isabella. "I should check on Gabrielle...if you know what I mean." ***Justin took another breath and swallowed. Even the meeting concerning past dangers seemed to be less intense than this one. "Helios is right; however, if we start creating incidents which induce fear, they may also decide to investigate the cause. As the years continue on, humans push harder because their technology advances. Think of places like the Bermuda Triangle, which generates fear among human beings. They investigate it with everything they have now to find out why things happen. The same would probably happen to us."

Timothy frowns at Quinlan. "What if that fear makes them fear us? Maybe fear will keep them away for another hundred years, but we will be in contact with humans eventually, if they don't destroy themselves first." He nods a bit to Justin, agreeing with that point.

Helios considers what Quinlan answers and shakes his head. "True, there is a line between threat and fear, but it's blurry at best. Humans do destroy what they concider a threat, but they do the same for what they fear and the only reason they would fear us, is if they thought we posed a threat to them. Either way I believe that the end result would be the same. Not good for us."

Tzolkin eardroops again and yawns, not planning to hold still or go along with any authority. After all, he has some rather strong dislikes of Justin in particular, and for good reason. For now he just sits to think, tail twitching idly. -- Kivan smirks a bit at Justin's reaction. "The very attitudes in this place proves that ve have more in common vith humans than ve care to admit." he falls silent for a moment after. -- Alex finally finishes writing whatever it is he is, blinking a few times as Quinlan's voice carries over the din, "If you fear something, is it not a threat to you? Continous fear breeds hate. If they fear us they will likely destroy the whole forest just to eradicate us. I say we just find somewhere else to live, if things get that bad." he intones.

( Vaspian looks towards Justin, his expression gentle and perhaps sympathising, seeming to get a sense of the leader's stress... "Yes... Which is why I would propose an alternative. If there is a way for us to mask our presense and avoid detection altogether, it's possible that even if they do come close, that they will pass this area by without incident.. Though I do agree that it would be important above all to be certain as to what their motives for being here are. )

Isabella nods to Zohar. "I'm sure she's fine, but she should know about this, too. Even if she can't leave the infirmary yet." She frowns, silently agreeing with Justin's opinion. *There's got to be another way...*

Raganzi's eyes glance around, watching for reactions as he begins to try and conjure up an idea. (I assume we're pretty much going whenever because it's more or less a discussion hall and of course a heated discussion will have interruptions right?)

Timothy looks over to Vaspian. "But... what if the humans start burning too close to the valley and it gets out of control? We could lose our crops, even if we could manage to save our home..."

Philip makes a small gesture to Justin to get his attention, "Perhaps it's best if we look into the facts of our current situation. This is an emotional time for us all, however we must not let our emotions deter good judgement."

Alex's comment attracts Helios' attention and he turns to view him. "Yes, exactly. Fear does breed hatred." He also finds himself nodding in agreement with Kivan's statement. This whole colonial system is remaniscant of something human. "Contact will happen, sooner or later....." Helios says to himself.

Zohar smiled softly and reached up to pat Isabella's shoulder. "Justin will need a nice back rub after this one..." he whispered before he started to set off for his own responsibilities, but he couldn't help but notice Kivan's words to which he replied. "And your attitude as well proves you're also like a human," he said . "We should have eyes in the air...any birds you happen to know would easily blend in and give us better estimates of how close they become." With that, Zohar bowed a little. ****Justin's eyes just happened to meet with Vaspian's own. Yes, he was starting to be stressed--he didn't get much peace anymore with the job and now that the colony was many more in number. "Humans modeled us after themselves, Kivan...what would you expect? We don't act like rats, but in a sense we also don't act like humans..which isn't the topic of his meeting," he said before looking to Philip. "Looking at the facts is what we've already planned to do. Scouts will be leaving shortly, unless I misunderstood Captain Leon?" He once again took the gavel in his paw and hit it against the hardness three more times. "Once more...there's only so much we can do in one meeting and the scouts will be going out. Right now we need a recess. We're all in the shock of learning this news and we're jumping too quickly..." ****Zohar perked up at that moment as he was leaving, "Jumping like lemmings!" he called.**** Justin snapped up at Zohar's words. "Yes, like lemmings! And to have birds in the air wouldn't be a bad idea either!"

Philip nods with Justin and starts to get ready to stand, agreeing with Justin's motion for a small break. "I will speak with Leon and ensure we have the scouts out of the colony tonight. " Philip with that comment to the leader made a tired stand and started heading towards the door, gesturing a hidden meaning to Leon on his way.

Brendan decides it'd most likely be best if he just doesn't say anything at all and just listens. He settles back in his seat, giving Cynthia a glance again, his eyes flickering with worry, though he offers a smile in attempt to keep a positive attitude. He gives her paw another squeeze, before sighing a bit, attention returning to the meeting.

Timothy quiets a bit at Justin's gavel hammers once more. Whatever he may think about anything else, he knows he's right about one thing; this is too much for just one meeting to decide on a course of action.

Raganzi remains quiet, his mind still running but unfortunately he keeps coming to the same solution. Although with this rat a solution has to benefit him in the long run as well so it's just a bit more difficult than usual this time.

Helios sighs and decides that he's wasted enough energy tonight on a largely un-responsive audience. "Yes. A recess, good idea."

Cynthia's arms stay around Brendan's, her cheek ending up pressing to his shoulder, gently rubbing over his arm as well with a paw.. She doesn't really seem worried.. or even scared right now, just... curious... - Vaspian nods softly to Justin. "I concur. One meeting rarely provides all of the answers needed. I'm confident though that regardless of whatever's necessary, we can overcome this.." Tim's question isn't lost upon him.. "That would need to be considered, I'm sure.. If possible, it may be best to salvage what is being grown, and to stockpile what can be until this passes.. It might be worth considering the idea of early food storage for the later seasons so that food doesn't grow scarce over time."

Helios querks an eyebrow to Vaspian. "Good idea, but that will require more workers. And there needs to be seedling preservation for future crops as well."

( Vaspian nods, smiling. "Quite.. We may all have to get our paws dirty, I suppose." )

( Justin set down his gavel and smiled at Vaspian for his agreement. "We recess, and when we come back let us be a little more orderly. Meanwhile, I wish to arrange a smaller, secondary meeting regarding our other issues, such internal colony issues within the next couple days. After all, we can't only focus on one issue." )

( Vaspian also nods to Justin. "If you wish, I'll be happy to attend. I do prefer to be helpful, but I don't wish to wear out my welcome either," he offers, apparently trying to insert mild humor to help lighten the atmosphere. )

Jeff watches as the noise in the room seemed to raise with people talking with one another about their opinions on the matter. He sat still in his seat, watching the colony council members vent stress from their faces. He shook his head briefly watching Justin's reaction and then turning his head to watch Leon and Philip walk out the door. It seems it only predictable that his return home would be a short one, this surely was a sign of it.

Brendan rises from his seat as the recess is called. "C'mon Cyn, let's go grab something to eat. I'm sure they have important stuff to talk about here..." He offers her a warm smile, reaching his paws down to help her up to her feet. "I've done enough worrying for one day, anyways...gotta go back to the whole 'positive thinking' thing..." he grins, giving Cynthia a playful poke in the side. "...that is, if positive thinking involves bugging the heck out of Anita..." he snickers slyly. "That never gets old."

( Cynthia smirks lightly... "Could always chase a big ball down the corridor. You used to love that," she says with a tease in her voice, though she gladly rises up with his help, food sounds good. )

( Kivan narrows his eyes at Zohar. "Why don't you just go back where you came from.." he grumbles, clearly tired of dealing with rodents who can't keep their tongues civil. He rubs his temples, "Oi.. perhaps I should have just said that you are bickering like small children.." Finally, the meeting seems over, and the old rat rises, a few vertibrae popping. -- Tzolkin looks up and around, already having abandoned following the meeting, so is surprised to see it over. -- Alex continues with his notetaking, momentarily oblivious to everyone. )

Philip walks out the door with Leon, nodding to Mark on the way out.

Mark returns the nod to the two guard members. His formality remained intact as he continued to watch the rest in the room with a bit of curiosity on what Justin's next move would be.

Timothy stands up and looks over to Brendan and Cynthia as the recess is called, not feeling quite as lighthearted as they seem to be. Still... he's not sure that this should be handled quite so unilateraly as Justin seems to be wanting to so far. Maybe he's just being overly worried. He sighs a bit, shaking his head, not sure what to do really. It kinda seemed like Brendan and Cynthia wanted to go by themselves, perhaps.

Brendan smirks in return and sticks his tongue out at Cynthia. "Yeah, and I also used to love pushing you into the lake, too..." he teases in return..."You don't see me doing -that- any more, do you?" He chuckles, before heading out into the hallway arm-in-arm with Cynthia.

Isabella remains where she is, at least for the moment, as others around her mill around.

( Cynthia does pause for a bit, turning to looking to Tim and seeing his expression.. She keeps ahold of Brendan's paw but moves a little towards him. "Are you okay? Wanna come along with us?" Course, he doesn't have to, though she's not bothered by trying to help her brother relax some too..Then again, Brendan seems eager to leave, so she finds herself being inched out of the room by his cohersion. n.n; - Vaspian finds himself looking towards Kivan, giving a faint chuckle. "I suppose I've grown used to bickering here and there. All will be straightened out in the end..." He does also pass more than just a glance at Zohar, almost seeming intrigued by the rat, considering following the rat for a moment. )

Zohar froze at Kivan's words and turned back around to look at him, and he did with a very nasty and volatile glare. It was one thing to criticize the colony; he did himself. It was another thing to be so open and vocal, but start something with him and one asked for a nightmare. "Go back where I came from, Sir? That would be NIMH, for your information. In fact, I was born the day before everyone escaped, carried in my mother's arms. We got separated, and very badly separated from the rest of you. An old rat you may be, but that day I was also separated from my father, the very rat who is responsible your all you being alive, only to end up cruched beneath a cinderblock. 'Go back where I came from' indeed, sir!" Zohar snorted, and snorted loudly. Oh that was a bad thing to say to him. And with that, he disappeared from the hall. Yes, he just admitted who his father was passively because at that moment he didn't care who knew. ***Justin nearly shot up at the sound of Zohar's anger but upon trying to say something he didn't and simple fall back in a chair.

Timothy follows after Brendan and Cynthia, hanging back a bit; no use infecting their good mood with his worries... He blinks when he hears Cynthia address him. "Uh... only if you two want me to. Don't want to be a bother..."

Timothy's ears fold back when he hears Zohar's outburst, cringing involuntarily, though he turns his attention back to Cynthia for the moment.

Brendan glances back at Timothy..."Are you kidding me? Tim, when have we really ever gone anywhere without you?" He grins. "You know you shouldn't have to ask to go with us. C'mon, we can find something to eat in the cafeteria and I can make myself look like an idiot for your amusement..." the mouse winks. "Which is an everyday occurance anyways, but...yeah..." Brendan snickers.

Vaspian's ears perk... the yin-yang colored mouse hrms.... and with a humble bow to the others, allows himself to depart as well, cane in paw, and as intended, follows the way Zohar exited at perhaps a more casual pace, though he now has more than a simply casual interest in this particular individual... - Cynthia shakes her head. "It's not a bother.. Besides, I think Jenny said she was gonna hang around near there too. Said she didn't really want to get in the way in here when I saw her last.

Helios smirks at Zohar's outburst. "Nimh is not our origin, nor that of our parents. It is a part of our lives, but not our beginnings. My mother carried young with in her 'during' those experaments, and as a result some of them didn't have a chance to 'begin' at all."

Timothy smiles to Brendan a bit sheepishly. "Heh, all right. Not sure I'll be able to tell the difference," he replies to Brendan with a playful smirk. His ears perk a little at the mention of Jenny, and his smile broadens a bit as he starts to follow them. "Lead on, then."

( Justin took a few more breaths after Zohar's...exit...the younger rat had a slight reputation for being incredibly harsh about certain things, though he knew why. His eyes eventually fell on Isabella, whom he wished to just run off with at the moment. "Well...that went...smooth.." )

Jeff eyes the rest of the crowd as it exits and he starts to stand up, feeling a bit of a drag as he does so, not sure if he was starting to feel the short sleep from his fast trip home with Xavier to report on their findings or if it was the meetings overview that was pulling at him.